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>The idea that matter is some created thing, rather than always existing, was forced into christianity by greek philosophy Do you have a Greek philosopher in mind to blame for creation ex nihilo? I can't think of or find any clear examples from a quick search. Even Plato's demiurge used preexisting matter. Stoics thought creation out of nothing was impossible and Zeus created the world out of himself. And many philosophers believed that the universe or its most fundamental element(s) have been around forever. Possibly the earliest really strong case of ex nihilo I know of -- even stronger than orthodox ex nihilo imo -- is what's attributed to the Christian gnostic Basilides by the heresiologist Hippolytus. "There was a time when nothing existed, neither matter nor form, nor accident, neither the simple nor the compound, neither the unknowable nor the invisible, neither man nor angel nor god nor any of these things which are called by names or perceived by the mind or the senses. Then, the not-being God, without consciousness, without perception, without purpose, without aim, without passion, without desire, had the will to create the world." Hippolytus thinks Basilides borrowed heavily from Aristotle, but Aristotle thought the universe was eternal, so Aristotle isn't the source for this doctrine. The wikipedia page on the topic says it was first explicitly articulated a bit later, in the late 2nd century, by Theophilus of Antioch, though.⏱ 39m↩